Hint of Hustle with Heather Sager

The Best 3 things Entrepreneurship Can Give You (and it’s not money)

May 23, 2022 Heather Sager Episode 150
Hint of Hustle with Heather Sager
The Best 3 things Entrepreneurship Can Give You (and it’s not money)
Show Notes Transcript

Get ready for some Sager Real Talk today.

Recently I had a big realization on how entrepreneurship— specifically becoming a digital CEO, has impacted my life beyond time freedom and money. 

In today’s episode I’m getting SUPER real, sharing with you a story I’ve never shared along with a message that will remind you where to put your focus as you build your business.

I sincerely hope you enjoy this one :)


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Well, hey, friends, welcome back. It's another beautiful frickin week at a springtime. How about you I am loving the fact that it is not dark at five o'clock in the morning when I wake up and go on my morning walks and get ready for my day. I hope you're enjoying the weather. And hey, I hope that you're enjoying this season of entrepreneurship wherever you are in your season. I wanted to record an episode today. This is inspired by some reflections that I had recently. I had this big aha moment last month, actually was two months ago. And it got me thinking about the biggest differences between now and back when I was like at my peak in corporate. If you're to the new to the show, I used to be an executive in a management firm in the medical space. I had the high powered job in the corner office that was encased in glass. I was on airplanes almost every single week speaking on stages, consulting, talking to groups. It was super fun. I loved my job. And when I think about now the fact that I put on button up pants for the first time in a while last week, I put on real clothes,I wore like a push up bra and heels in New York City, schmoozing media producers like but normally I've been leggings and sweatpants and I have the daily debate is whether or not I'm actually going to shower or put on makeup. 


There's a difference between the world that I'm in now and the one that I was in just five years ago. And what's interesting as I was reflecting between the two, and when I thought about what's changed beyond the financial pieces and the like sheer flexibility that I have in my life, to meet my kids after school, to work out in the afternoon, to not have to commute anymore, oh my gosh, to not have to commute. It's wonderful. Those are the obvious things that we talk about when it comes to entrepreneur life, especially if you're an entrepreneur now whether you're full time or you're working to become full time in your business. We all know that freedom, flexibility and money are a big, like a lot of reasons why people want to pursue the entrepreneurial life but I was really fascinated when I started reflecting on what else has become possible for me by becoming a full time entrepreneur specifically in the type of business I have today, which is having a digital based online business, which means I don't know if you notice because it surprises most people to learn. So my title, I call myself a speaking coach. Y'all, I don't work one on one with clients, very often.


I only have a handful of clients. Right now, I have two, one on one clients. One of them is an annual client that has me on for the entire year. We meet in person once a quarter this year and we meet every other week on a zoom. That's one of my clients. And then I take a handful of clients to help them with their keynote. But the majority of my business, the majority of my time is running a digital business, which means I make the majority of my revenue from digital products, affiliate products, that's just a very tiny, tiny percentage, but mostly my scalable group coaching program, like that's how I make money and it means that I work less than 20 hours a week and I work on the things that I love doing, and I have a team that's all over the world that supports me in this business. And if you would have asked me five years ago, if this is what I'd be doing now. I would have, I would have imagined it. I knew I wanted it, but I didn't really know how that'd be possible. But I would never expect it, the benefits that I've gotten from having this life and I wanted to share it with you today not because I'm some kind of like, y'all, I'm not one of those ginormous businesses online, those really big brands. I'm not bad. I'm aspiring to grow my business to that level. But I'm just the girl with a microphone sitting in Westland, Oregon right now out my window. I'm staring at my backyard, which is the fence is probably 30 feet away from my house and I can clearly see in my neighbor's house. I mean I'm not talking a glamorous lifestyle here. But honestly, if I think about it, most of the entrepreneurs that I connect with online, we're not like scrambling to go work in Fiji, or, I don't know, do yoga all day, or I don't know, nothing's wrong with yoga. I enjoy yoga. But there's this like picture that we think that success means big jets, fancy watches, or living on the beach. And if you don't have those aspirations are something wrong with you or you're doing it wrong. And I just want to give you a little love here that creating your own business, part of becoming an entrepreneur is figuring out what you want life to look like, to feel like, and then leaning into that without getting swept up in the success definitions of other people. 


You know, I work actually, ironically, a lot of my clients have been working over the last year have had that similar message in with their audiences is helping people unpack this idea of you don't have to sweep into other people's definitions of success and you can define it for yourself, and I've definitely found that to be true within my business. But I wanted to share some these insights with you today to provoke your thought process around how you're feeling in business, maybe what you want to get out of business. And today, there's no like, hard set game plan today of like, I'm gonna teach you the seven strategies how to kick ass in business. That is not today's message. This is an episode where I want you to imagine that you and I are sitting together over a cup of coffee, or a margarita, or a glass of Rose', sparkling. That's my choice. I want you just think about we're just two friends chatting about business. And if you've been feeling a little uninspired lately, where you feel like things are just taking fricking forever, or it's not clicking, or maybe you're feeling like why is everybody else doing it and you're not. These are things that we all have felt or actively feel in business, you're not alone. I just want you to know there's someone here who gets it. And while it might look sometimes that I totally have my shit together online, I do have my shit together online and I'm a real human and I share that human side.


I think we all have to start acknowledging more of that. We asked, we're business owners, but we're also people. I know a lot of people fight to keep it separate the business versus the personal side. But honestly, it's very blended. And I don't know today's conversation is want to share with you a little bit of my heart around some of the realizations that I've had, some of the things I've received from my businesses and experienced over the last few years. So in no particular order, let's start with we'll start with this number one, relationships that I never otherwise would have. One of the most powerful things that I have gotten out of running an online business is relationships and not just business networking relationships to get referrals, hahaha. I don't know why I felt the need to do that voice but I'm talking about actual friendships, both in the business sense but also in the personal sense. I don't know if you resonate at all with this but how I talk to a lot of entrepreneurs that have always been, they've always felt this was definitely me always felt a little different in their social circles or their business circles in the past that they're was something about the edge of ambition that we had that kind of turned people off, or maybe got other people just being like who the hell are you or you think you're so smart or you think you're so cool. We've always felt this little like, we didn't quite blended, unsettled. We were not quite content with how things were and maybe other people aren't so down with that, but there's something beautiful that has happened. 


Becoming an entrepreneur and putting myself in environments with other entrepreneurs with similar values, similar attitudes around personal growth, business growth, what's possible in life, what life really could be, not what it has to be. That's opened me up to some incredible relationships. Now, some of these have been friendships. I've talked on the show many times I have two business besties I talk to almost every single day, Melanie Diane Howe and Krystal Proffitt who have both been guests on the show. We talked about, in fact, we'll link to it, we had an episode all around creating a peer mastermind we did last year, and it was just a fun little dialogue. You get a little peek into that. I would have never met Krystal and Mel. They're two women who have online businesses. They both are moms. Fun fact, I've never met Krystal in real life. Mel and I met but we didn't really know each other in real life. We became friends through Voxer, which is crazy to me. But there are two people that have been solid staples in my life, both personally and professionally. 


I also think about relationships that I've had where I've been able to be in the room with extremely talented and successful business owners. And I've been in there as peers and I think how crazy it is looking around the room, I think about this media event I was at back in NYC. It'll be two weeks ago, by the time you're listening to this. But it was it would have been very easy for me to be like, Oh man, I'm like not as far along or fancy pants as the people in this room. And instead, because of the approach that I have in online business, these are people and these are a really great opportunity to build relationships. So number one, thinking about one of the most beautiful things I've gotten around having a an online business,becoming an entrepreneur, I honestly think specifically with this online piece is I meet people from all over the world. And it's really interesting to not just build relationships, but be curious and get to know people. As an introvert, I've talked about this before, as an introvert. I surprisingly, I am not the person to go to networking events. And if I do, I am not the person that will walk around and introduce myself to everyone smiling. I am the person going, I need a wing woman and a drink and beverage in my hand to limit the awkwardness. That beverage could be a sparkling water with a lime, or it could be a cocktail. But I have something in my hand at all times to make it a little less awkward. It's awkward when you're like you're both your hands are free and you're standing around networking. I'm just not that person to walk around and be like, hello, tell me your life story. That just is like not. For so many reasons, that is not, it's just not me. 


However, when I, in this online space, when you meet people on the Internet, whether it's through like following someone and you see their stories every single day, and you engage with their stories, and then all of a sudden you're in their DMs and you're chatting back and forth. And you realize like, wow, I know this person, but I don't actually know this person, but I know this person, that could be a start of a beautiful friendship. In fact, I have many of those on Instagram. Same thing around, if you're in a digital course or a coaching program or a mastermind you start seeing the same faces over and over and you develop this camaraderie that you get them and you're similar. Those are moments where you have the choice to say, am I going to reach out and actually build a connection? Not because I want them to like to get something out of them but but genuinely because I want to find other like minded people on this journey. 


So I guess we're turning this into a little bit of a teaching episode right there where I've encouraged you to think about where are you? Where you around other people that are inspiring that have the kinds of attitude that you want to have everyday, that have the kinds of businesses you want to have every day, that have that the kind of thinking that you want to keep on repeat. So on the days that you fall down the rabbit hole or be like oh my gosh, the world is ending. How do you surround yourself with those people that are going to keep you focused on what matters and the progress that you're making. Building relationships online was really really powerful for me and a lot of it is because I don't know maybe you're like this tool, I've always been a, this is going to be a really weird admission. Buckle up. I might regret sharing this. I have always been a situational friend person. I have learned this as my adult life. When I've developed friendships, we go hard, we have so much fun. I connect really, really well with people. And it's typically for a season in life and then there is a sunset, whether that's high school friends, college friends, roommates, friends in old jobs. I have some incredible friends in my life. I'm still friends with till this day. However, they're not active friends in my life phase right now. And if I'm being super real, which I am, we're alreayy here. I always felt this huge sense of guilt for not being the person who could call her five childhood best friends or college friends that are still her best friends today. I thought, I know people who have that and I'm like, oh my gosh, there's something wrong with me because I don't have that. 


But over the last five years, specifically, and now this new role and what I'm doing now in my business, I've really learned that there's nothing wrong with me, there's nothing wrong with letting friendships sunset and embracing your next evolution of you. Because as you grow, the reality is your friends will change. So one of the beautiful gifts that I've received as an entrepreneur in this online space is really that clarifying and freeing feeling that friendships will come and go, and there's nothing wrong with that. Look for the friendships that are going to enrich your life now and friendships that you can enrich theirs. So that's my little nod nod if you are feeling a little lonely friends wise. Reach out, start reaching out to people, reach out to me, let's chat on Instagram, I'll all rah rah cheer on all your Instagram stuff. But find some real connections. And hey, if you are one of those people that you can name on, like you even know the original phone number of your best friend from grade school and you still talk to her every single week like that is a special beautiful thing. And just like high five to you, you hold that tight, like that is that it's just beautiful. Not me. Not for me. But it's for you. It's beautiful. 


Okay, the second thing that I have taken from, or taken, yeah, we could say taken, but really gotten out of my journey as an entrepreneur is the most incredible and random set of skills. So this has been something that has been fascinating and I know this is gonna ring true for you. As an entrepreneur, right, we get started because there's something that we're really damn good at and we're sick of doing that thing for someone else. And we're like, oh, man, I want to do this for my own. Then we start stumbling down the rabbit hole like Alice in Wonderland into online business and realize like, holy crap, there's this whole world here. Like, what if I could create a course or a membership or a thing of a joke and do the thing that I love all the time? And then we're faced with the stark reality of here, do you have to learn how to buy a website domain? Oh, and where to host it? And by the way, do you know that if you have a domain, you have to figure out how to plug the domain thingy in the mud jigaboo, so you actually can make your email work? And oh my gosh, do you know how to start the G Suite account so you can send people real emails from your actual @whatever domain.com It was like a very specific thing. But I just had a flashback of going, oh my gosh, I remember the moment I had to figure that out and my brain cord plunked, and I said, I can do new things. I can do hard things, I can figure it out. And I had forgotten just how fricking creative and resourceful I was. 


I think one of the things is working in corporate, and I think this is tricky. But once you get in a rhythm with a job, right? We were always stretched. There was always really incredible, like innovative products. I was very lucky. I worked for a company that was highly innovative and we created things all the time. I mean, I ran the training department where we were literally coming up with programs all of the time and innovative ways to teach it. We were on leading the curve on online curriculum for digital courses. We were doing webinars, we were doing in person boot camps. I mean, one time, literally, in my office, we invented this two week boot camp for doctors, for newer doctors who were trying to learn this new process for patient care. And the people were struggling to learn it in a week and they were then doing online or phone call coaching for months. The question was like, what if we actually flew to Portland and did like a two week boot camp? And then it was like who the hell would fly for two weeks for boot camp? Well turns out like 20 people for that first session paid multiple 1000s of dollars to come out for that thing. 


So here's the thing like you can be innovative and in all kinds of positions and such before but when you are in this blank slate that is entrepreneurship, everything is a blank canvas, which also can be very overwhelming because you then have to figure out like, how do I focus and get things done like it's almost to blank. But one of the most I don't know, the incredible thing is that I have really loved that I didn't realize I would love so much is I love learning and I love exploring and learning new things. I mean, I'm learning Pinterest and Instagram and lately Instagram reels. And I'm learning how to use keywords and how to run the backend of a website and all about pulling together funnels and KPIs and all these wonderful things that are, maybe for some like one a roll their eyes out, but I love getting my hands dirty and learning it, and I love teaching my team how to take things over so I'm not the one always doing it. 


The thing about learning is, it's a blessing and a curse, right. I know a lot of people, especially entrepreneurs, and like I just love learning, however, they get swept up into the online course game where they just learn, learn, learn, learn, learn, learn, and we forget the part where we actually have to stop and execute, fall on our faces, retool, execute again and again, and again and again. And again, until we start getting results. There's that piece there. But for me, I really have loved this challenge of saying, how do I not just learn new skills, but how can I apply them effectively and efficiently and get results from them, and then move on to the next skill, and be choosy in which skills I really hone in on master. 


So I'll give you an example of this some of the skills that I've just learned and gotten through. I guess these are gonna be some fun shares. So I took a course on how to run a challenge, I took a course around how to get started with YouTube, I have a course around getting started with reels, like all these things, quite frankly, I would just like jump in, grab a couple things and move on. However, there's a couple courses where I'm like, ooh, I really am going to sift into this, programs on messaging, on funnels, on copywriting. Those are three areas where I've really leaned into specifically evergreen funnels and copywriting. Those were ones that I knew would be instrumental my business. So I really spend time here mastering the skill. So a beautiful gift learning, being challenged, being creative, but also being forced to figure out my own discipline. But on that same end, is figuring out which skills to like, check the box so you can move on or which skills do you lean in on master? That's a really powerful reflection exercise. So yeah, we're making this a teaching episode. Here we go again. So that would be a good gut check for you is what skills are you're learning right now and which ones are actually required for you to get your next level? Because chances are maybe right now you're spending your time learning on something, tthat's a nice to have skill, but it's actually not necessary to your next level.


And the question is, is that skill that you're learning right now, because it feels so fun? And you will know you're going to want to have this one day? Is that actually a safety net that you're doing that because you're scared that you don't have what it's going to take to get to your next level? Oh my gosh, I just threw the gauntlet down on that one. I don't know if that's true. But I know, I find myself procrastinating sometimes by telling myself I have to learn this thing. I have to learn this thing. I have to learn this thing. But if I'm being honest, I don't actually have to learn this thing. So there's my insight turned into tough love for you start auditing what you're actually learning and enjoy that learning process. Call yourself the lifelong learner and call yourself an entrepreneur that gets things done, apply that learning or put it on the shelf, check the box, come back to it when you actually need it. 


Okay, this last insight here that I wanted to share. This is actually the reason why I wanted to record this episode and will probably be the most difficult for me to talk about. So my biggest insight, like of all the things, right, the biggest transformation for me beyond the money beyond the time, freedom and flexibility that I have now, those are all the buzzwords that people say, beyond the last two things that I said. The thing that has it snuck up on me, I had no idea this happened, and it did and it has been the most powerful transformation of my life. Are you ready for it? When I was in the corporate world, building my career and, actually, let's just date back my entire career. When I was in high school, I did the Running Start program which if you don't know what that is essentially is local college gives you the opportunity to take community college courses for free while you're in high school and you get credits for high school and in college. For me I grew up in a, I mean a house, we did not have a lot of money. My dad was a truck driver. My mom was a seamstress who worked out of a bedroom in her house actually most of the time from a dining room kitchen table and she made enough money to cover her crafting hobbies. And we didn't have a lot of money growing up, and I knew that if I wanted to go to college, which I was very adamant I did. I was the second in my family to graduate from college of six kids and I'm the youngest kid. I knew I wanted to go to college and I knew that I could not ask my parents to help with that. When I was in high school, my mom was, as freshman, my mom was first diagnosed with breast cancer. And so my parents were still grappling with debt from that cancer care. And I just, I knew I was going to ask my parents. So I, when I had the opportunity, a junior in high school, I started taking college credits and I filled up my calendar. I had soccer, I was doing college level courses, I was in high school, I had a lot of things happening. And then if you're familiar with my story, you know, between my junior and senior year of high school, my mom's cancer metastasized to her liver and it was a terminal diagnosis, August, before my senior year. So I went into my senior year knowing that I probably would not come out on the other side with my mom.


And my family, incredible, like I was the only kid still living at home. And I remember like really specific things. I remember, I decided to become a cheerleader that year. Funny like random story. I won't get into that one. But I have a very vivid memory of when my mom needed to shave her head because her hair was falling out from chemo. I remember it was before one of my football games. And I was in my cheerleading uniform and I was holding the hose of the vacuum. Well, I don't remember who was my dad or my sister was, but somebody shaved my mom's head and I had the vacuum to scoop up all the hair. That was my life. And so fast forward, we started a nonprofit organization. It was my mom's last Christmas present. And we ran that for a few months and my mom, she passed right before her 50th birthday, that spring. And from that moment, until a few years ago, my life was a sprint. I was a high achiever. I went straight from high school, I got a full time job at a photography studio while going to community college. I worked full time all through college, that head start by the way did really give me that much of a head start because I had to figure out what the hell I was doing with my life and grief for my mom. 


So it took me, kid you not, it took me years, like so many years to graduate from college. I didn't actually graduate from college until I was 25 years old and I worked full time the entire way. I worked full time, which school full time. I had friendships. I had a very, very full life I was sprinting. I was sprinting and what I didn't know as I was running. Fast forward right after college, I had been working in different businesses all through college. In fact, many of them are small family based entrepreneur businesses. Right after college, actually, while I was in my senior year, my last semester, I got a job at a medical company, a medical consulting company as events coordinator and that job was a flat out sprint. I was planning events in cities all over the world. I was in school 24 credits whileworking. It was in freaking intense and that spoilered is the job that I then climbed the ladder into an executive seat in the span of just a few years. And that was the job that took me around the world speaking on stages, consulting, working with independent business owners and that was the job that built the platform that I have today. 


I share this with you because when I quit that job, when I created this home office in the spare bedroom and started building this online business, whether it was consulting or one on one, and then into my programs, and especially two years ago, when the pandemic happened, and I was forced to really slow down, just like everyone, right? We were slowed, like forced to slow down, stay home, and we couldn't do a lot. I know I had, like you most likely have kids at home. I had to handle all of that. Like I just could not work. And for the first time in almost 20 years, I was forced to focus on the present moment and that might sound really really weird to some of you. Maybe for others, you're like oh yeah, girl, me too. But for the first time in my entire adult life I was actually forced to be in the moment. And this really interesting realization happened. I learned that I had a really shitty memory. I had a really shitty memory. I'm gonna say this because my memory was, I was moving so fast from event to event, from function to function, from meeting to meeting, from project to project, from thing to thing. I was always moving so fast. The only way I can describe it as my brain could not keep up with that short term memory. But it was like that movie Inside Out, that Disney Pixar movie, Inside Out, where they have the little characters like anger and sad news, and all the other ones joy. They were just like constantly saying, screw you, you're going so fast. We are not bank in any of these memories. 


And I had this realization, this was what hit me, earlier this week that I don't know, I felt like I had to share it. I had this realization of like, wow, what happened to the last 20 years? I know they were amazing and I do have plenty of memories. I mean, don't misconstrue what I'm saying. I have plenty plenty of memories. But I realized that I was so focused on sprinting, sprinting to where I don't know, I was running from the grief, from losing my mom and I was sprinting towards this future that I had pictured for myself. And it was in this constant running away and running towards attitude, that was my life. And the biggest gift becoming an entrepreneur has given me is the power to say, screw all of that and just be here, right now. And I think this is one of the things that I'm so passionate about because as this entrepreneurs face, we're constantly being told, like, what's that big future? What's that big thing you want? And do all those activities and I have I have the vision board and that's a huge part of my daily practice. But I've also learned that here and right now at this moment is the only thing that we have. 


So if you're sitting here, and you're going, Oh, this this thing, I'm not where I want to be yet. I don't know what I'm building. I don't know what this is about, like I'm not far enough ahead or why is it so hard? Whatever is happening through your mind right now, wherever you're feeling as an entrepreneur, hear me when I say this. This right here, this is it. This is the life. it sn't the thing that's going to come on the beach in 10 years from now. It's not going to be the private jet which sidenote can we like rent one of those because I really want to go to a private jet. But it's not all about those things. Like that's the fun thing to dreamed of, we're working towards that, yes, but what's happening right now, what you're building is this freaky moment, right now. And I've never been the kind of person who can sit still, the idea of yoga, or meditation or anything like that has always just made my skin crawl. And what I've realized, particularly in these last few years, it's because I was always running. I was running for my feelings. I was running for my awareness, I was running towards something better. And the crappy part about all of that was every single moment that I had, was such a beautiful moment had I chosen to focus on it. 


So when I look back and see what are the most beautiful gifts entrepreneurship has given me, it's given me a life and not some big fancy pants,look at me and all the fancy crap I have. I don't have that much fancy stuff here, people. My business is not very large. It's given me my life. It's given me the presence, the clarity to say, I know why I'm here. I might not be as far along as I would have liked to be but look how far I've come. You and me, we have made something out of nothing. There was no business before this moment. And the look, you made it like you made a frickin business. Look, you're here. You made a blog post you you frickin sent an email to 100 people or 10 people or thousands people like you did that. I I've always been a terrible person when it comes to celebrating myself. But this has been the year where I've said look at all of this. I did that. 


You did that. I think we need to slow down sometimes and really understand, appreciate, honor the fact that we're magical. We're building these incredible things to give us these incredible lives. And well, somedays, it might feel hard, it might not feel like you're on time. It might feel like a big blubbering mess. I mean, right now, let's get real. This is not a video episode for a reason because I have snot rolling down. We're just going to take care of that, rolling down my face. This is not pretty. All the moments don't have to be pretty but they are here, they are here, they are now and that is a beautiful thing. So that's it. That's it. That was a lot. That was a lot. That's that was what was on my heart that I needed to share today because I knew someone, maybe it was you needed to hear it. Entrepreneurship is not a race. Life is not a race. Slow fricking down, slow down. And if maybe, like me, you've been running from something slow down and let it out. Talk to someone, to have therapy, whatever you need. I know for me, we just celebrated the 20 year reunion, 20 year anniversary of my mom's death. It's ironically, my most popular real on Instagram. I become the Oops, my mom died girl on Instagram reels which, if you've ever lost a parent, it's okay for us to talk and make jokes about it. It's how we cope with the grief. 


But this last year, this anniversary hit me harder than the other one and it was because I allowed the grief into my life. It'll tell you it was the most beautiful and ugly cry filled time and it was the most necessary thing I needed in my life. So I don't know if that's striking you at the right moment. Maybe there is a feeling that you've been running away from, embrace it. If you need to talk to someone, talk to someone. If you need a friend, find a friend. Hence the first thing I talked about today. Have your pack of people that you go to. But the most important thing is be present in the moment  and enjoy. Enjoy this thing that you're building because it is yours and it is beautiful and it is magical and it has the potential to change the world. And when I say the world, I don't mean the giant world of all these strangers that you don't know. I mean your world. Because if the first place to start, if you want to change the world, you have to change it for yourself, change how you view it. And if you start being more appreciative for the moments that you have, you start honoring the incredible things you do, you start celebrating the magic that you're creating for your audiences. That momentum will help you in your journey. 


Okay, friend, I hope that, I don't know, I hope this was like the most rambly podcast episode I've ever recorded. And I hope that you did not hear my snot on the episode. But if you did, like keepin it real, friend. I'd love to hear from you. It's one of these like vulnerability hangovers. If this resonate with you today, would you send me a message on Instagram or screenshot it? Share it so I can have a bigger vulnerability hangover with more strangers in this online world. I would really mean the world. If this resonated with you and you think it would benefit some of your other entrepreneur friends, please share it. And I have a special treat next week. I am bringing in my my Business Coach, James Wedmore. I know, the last episode, if you missed it go back. He shared an incredible episode that actually really resonates with what I talked about today, around how do you actually create this life of working less, and earning more creating that space for these things I mentioned today so go back and listen to that one episode. And next week, I'm actually sitting down and interviewing James. So I'm asking him specifically questions from me around navigating this online space about the early days things to think about when it comes to imposter syndrome and how you push through that to get yourself out there as a digital product business, or more scalable programs, whatever that looks like. So stay tuned. We'll get that next week. Thanks for letting me bear my heart today and I'll talk to you soon.